Jim Traber Forum: Oil Spill

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Annie
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Posted: 27 June 2010 at 8:57pm

Originally posted by oklanole

Fwiw, I am not being difficult. I just see it as Fox had mote viewers than all the other media outlets but to not call them mainstream when more people watch them seems odd.

They do not have the same number of viewers. Matter of fact, they are not even ranked in the same group. Nielsen ranks cable separately. If you peruse the rankings and media numbers, you will find ABC, CBS, and NBC have far more viewers than Fox.

“If you don’t know where you are going, any road will get you there.”
― Lewis Carroll

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boomerjake
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 9:05am

Originally posted by oklanole

Originally posted by roy4pokes

Originally posted by oklanole

Slightly OT, but who is the mainstream media? I see posted on here from time to time that Fox has the best marketshare of viewers by a longshot.

In my opinion, mainstream media is ABC, NBC, CBS, print media such as the New York Times, Washington Post. I don't consider media such as Fox and CNN to be mainstream because they are a cable news networks. MSNBC is part of NBC, so could be considered somewhat mainstream.

So how exactly is Fox different from the above stations? Or the NY Post from the times? I understand you said opinion but that seems to be a lot of cherry picking. MSNBC is also a cable news network so if you consider them somewhat mainstream, then so is Fox. Also, the last time I was flipping channels, Fox came up in the same tier as ABC et.al. Your differences seem quite arbitrary.

Oklanole, Fox has only been in existence, what 13, 14 years? Even journalists within the profession consider the old standard bearers like ABC, NBC, CBS, NY Times, Wapo, etc… as “main stream” media.

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oklanole
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 10:02am

Jake, the same can be said for msnbc also. I haven't gotten a chance to look at Nielson but according to the wiki Fox is leading the pack in ratings. To keep this from going further off topic, it just amazes me that people will give Fox a pass. Case in point, this morning at the gym, top of the hour and Fox leads with Biden going off about something. CNN and all the rest had coverage of Byrd passing.

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dockbumper5
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 10:16am

Originally posted by boomerjake

It’s sad that you have to think the worst of someone’s motives. But when you look at the facts, not waiving the Jones act, slowing state and local government from acting, refusing the help from other country’s assets, what else could someone deduce?

You remind me of the people who said George Bush lied just to invade Iraq..........., are you really serious?? What else could someone deduce??? How about this, Obama and his team have no idea on how to handle a crisis? They are/were afraid to take control of the spill. They are incompetent. Obama is not qualified. etc.........., don't expect people with common sense to believe Obama is actually happy this happened, and he wants it to keep getting worse.......

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boomerjake
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 10:55am

Originally posted by dockbumper5

Originally posted by boomerjake

And you remind me of the jackass who thought their rent, gas, and groceries were all going to be paid with the election of Obama. Look you nitwit, it wasn’t me who said, "Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." You’re such a buffoon you have no idea who is the originator of that quote. With statements like that, and confirmation by their actions, it’s completely plausible this administration would use it to the political advantage.

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boomerjake
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:01am

Originally posted by oklanole

Jake, the same can be said for msnbc also. I haven't gotten a chance to look at Nielson but according to the wiki Fox is leading the pack in ratings. To keep this from going further off topic, it just amazes me that people will give Fox a pass. Case in point, this morning at the gym, top of the hour and Fox leads with Biden going off about something. CNN and all the rest had coverage of Byrd passing.

The same could have been said of MSNBC for what? How long they've been existance? oklanole, they're apart of NBC. Give Fox a pass on what?

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Annie
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:01am

Originally posted by dockbumper5

Originally posted by boomerjake

I don't think he wanted this to happen or wants it to get worse............. just as I don't think that he wants American citizens being killed and living in fear along the Tucson zone of the Arizona-Mexican border. I do, however, think that he is unwilling to do that which is necessary to assist these people. I don't know if he is afraid of the unions, feels that nothing will work and it is in the best interest of the federal government to wait until they are in a position of power where they can get the bills passed (cap and 'tax', amnesty in an omnibus immigration bill, etc.). What comes across is that this President will continue the practice of his years in the Illinois legislature and the U.S. Senate: sit on the fence and watch others batter their brains out and then try to come in and fashion a win out of the remaining pieces.

“If you don’t know where you are going, any road will get you there.”
― Lewis Carroll

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dockbumper5
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:02am

Originally posted by boomerjake

Originally posted by dockbumper5

Originally posted by boomerjake

Your name calling tells it all....touched a nerve and you don't know how to handle it......You remind me of a few things too jake, but I won't stoop to your level. Have fun in the gutter.....

Edited by dockbumper5 - 28 June 2010 at 11:03am

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boomerjake
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:13am

Originally posted by dockbumper5

Originally posted by boomerjake

Originally posted by dockbumper5

Originally posted by boomerjake

Your name calling tells it all....touched a nerve and you don't know how to handle it......You remind me of a few things too jake, but I won't stoop to your level. Have fun in the gutter.....

One of your recent posts spoke of how you know you’re hated. I got a chuckle out of that. Why? Because you’re irrelevant. You’re not thought enough by anyone to care one way or the other. I’ve gotten to where I only take a casual interest in something you posts, and then when I do I end up wishing I had those few seconds back in my life. And the name calling, well you’ve earned, so wear it well.

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Annie
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:17am

Oklanole, Jake, whoever......................Each of you may have your own definition of 'mainstream media'. Some people put anything in the category that is liberal. Others throw in Fox (the only media that puts forward views other than liberals.............and they even include some liberals). In the dictionary, mainstream is defined as "The prevailing current of thought, influence, or activity". A couple decades ago the tag was applied to the print and TV media that dominated throughout the country. The large media types seen or read across the country included the likes of ABC, CBS, NBC, NY Times, Chicago Tribune, Washington Post, LA Times and the like. Cable news was not included at that time. It did not have the reach. As to now, only Fox News is seen by a significant number of people and it is dwarfed by the combo of ABC, CBS, & NBS (who often sign out of the same hymnal).

Oklanole, this is NOT a word made up by people on this forum. Personally, when I use the term, I am not referencing any cable news.

“If you don’t know where you are going, any road will get you there.”
― Lewis Carroll

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dockbumper5
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:27am

Originally posted by boomerjake

Originally posted by dockbumper5

Originally posted by boomerjake

Originally posted by dockbumper5

Originally posted by boomerjake

Your name calling tells it all....touched a nerve and you don't know how to handle it......You remind me of a few things too jake, but I won't stoop to your level. Have fun in the gutter.....

Whatever........if you are proud of your name calling, that tells me all I need to know about you. Have fun living in the gutter.....

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oklanole
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 3:30pm

Jake/Annie, I was only considering cable. Both FNC and MSNBC came to cable around the same time.
Jake, when I say pass it is to the numerous here that seems to think that Fox doesn't have a slant. I saw it once again this morning with Byrd v Biden as mentioned above.

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Annie
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 4:05pm

Originally posted by oklanole

Jake/Annie, I was only considering cable. Both FNC and MSNBC came to cable around the same time.
Jake, when I say pass it is to the numerous here that seems to think that Fox doesn't have a slant. I saw it once again this morning with Byrd v Biden as mentioned above.

Oklanole, this is not my definition. For years the definition revolved around the large media that was read, seen, heard across the country. Only in the last few years has Fox news come to the point that it has pushed a million viewers. Cable news did not reach the masses when the term began to be used. Matter of fact, when the term was first coined, Fox news did not exist.

I have not thought or had the impression that Fox did not have a slant in its op ed programming. I do not look at Hannity as hard news......................The same goes for Olbermann. On the straight news side (i.e., Baier, Wallace, the morning and afternoon news, etc.), there is much effort to provide more than one side of an issue. What I hear is that if one wants to have a clue about a conservative, Republican or Libertarian slant, you will find it difficult on ABC news, NBC news, CBS news, the NY Times, the Washington Post, etc. Conversely, you can find people expressing liberal/Democratic views on Fox.

“If you don’t know where you are going, any road will get you there.”
― Lewis Carroll

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roy4pokes
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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 4:32pm

sure Fox, CNN and MSNBC have slants. Especially Fox and MSNBC. But if you do an internet search regarding the definition of "mainstream media", Fox and MSNBC and CNN are not included in most, if not all, definitions. At least not now.

"Life's tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." - John Wayne

Go green - recycle Congress in 2010

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Author	Message
Annie Ultimate Joined: 02 May 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 17544	Posted: 27 June 2010 at 8:57pm
	*Originally posted by oklanole* Fwiw, I am not being difficult. I just see it as Fox had mote viewers than all the other media outlets but to not call them mainstream when more people watch them seems odd. They do not have the same number of viewers. Matter of fact, they are not even ranked in the same group. Nielsen ranks cable separately. If you peruse the rankings and media numbers, you will find ABC, CBS, and NBC have far more viewers than Fox.
	“If you don’t know where you are going, any road will get you there.” ― Lewis Carroll
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boomerjake Big League Joined: 22 April 2009 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 4303	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 9:05am
	*Originally posted by oklanole* *Originally posted by roy4pokes* *Originally posted by oklanole* Slightly OT, but who is the mainstream media? I see posted on here from time to time that Fox has the best marketshare of viewers by a longshot. In my opinion, mainstream media is ABC, NBC, CBS, print media such as the New York Times, Washington Post. I don't consider media such as Fox and CNN to be mainstream because they are a cable news networks. MSNBC is part of NBC, so could be considered somewhat mainstream. So how exactly is Fox different from the above stations? Or the NY Post from the times? I understand you said opinion but that seems to be a lot of cherry picking. MSNBC is also a cable news network so if you consider them somewhat mainstream, then so is Fox. Also, the last time I was flipping channels, Fox came up in the same tier as ABC et.al. Your differences seem quite arbitrary. Oklanole, Fox has only been in existence, what 13, 14 years? Even journalists within the profession consider the old standard bearers like ABC, NBC, CBS, NY Times, Wapo, etc… as “main stream” media.
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oklanole Solid Individual Joined: 19 April 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 882	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 10:02am
	Jake, the same can be said for msnbc also. I haven't gotten a chance to look at Nielson but according to the wiki Fox is leading the pack in ratings. To keep this from going further off topic, it just amazes me that people will give Fox a pass. Case in point, this morning at the gym, top of the hour and Fox leads with Biden going off about something. CNN and all the rest had coverage of Byrd passing.
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dockbumper5 Big Daddy Joined: 06 January 2010 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 2510	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 10:16am
	*Originally posted by boomerjake* It’s sad that you have to think the worst of someone’s motives. But when you look at the facts, not waiving the Jones act, slowing state and local government from acting, refusing the help from other country’s assets, what else could someone deduce? You remind me of the people who said George Bush lied just to invade Iraq..........., are you really serious?? What else could someone deduce??? How about this, Obama and his team have no idea on how to handle a crisis? They are/were afraid to take control of the spill. They are incompetent. Obama is not qualified. etc.........., don't expect people with common sense to believe Obama is actually happy this happened, and he wants it to keep getting worse.......
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boomerjake Big League Joined: 22 April 2009 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 4303	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 10:55am
	*Originally posted by dockbumper5* *Originally posted by boomerjake* It’s sad that you have to think the worst of someone’s motives. But when you look at the facts, not waiving the Jones act, slowing state and local government from acting, refusing the help from other country’s assets, what else could someone deduce? You remind me of the people who said George Bush lied just to invade Iraq..........., are you really serious?? What else could someone deduce??? How about this, Obama and his team have no idea on how to handle a crisis? They are/were afraid to take control of the spill. They are incompetent. Obama is not qualified. etc.........., don't expect people with common sense to believe Obama is actually happy this happened, and he wants it to keep getting worse....... And you remind me of the jackass who thought their rent, gas, and groceries were all going to be paid with the election of Obama. Look you nitwit, it wasn’t me who said, "Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." You’re such a buffoon you have no idea who is the originator of that quote. With statements like that, and confirmation by their actions, it’s completely plausible this administration would use it to the political advantage.
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boomerjake Big League Joined: 22 April 2009 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 4303	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:01am
	*Originally posted by oklanole* Jake, the same can be said for msnbc also. I haven't gotten a chance to look at Nielson but according to the wiki Fox is leading the pack in ratings. To keep this from going further off topic, it just amazes me that people will give Fox a pass. Case in point, this morning at the gym, top of the hour and Fox leads with Biden going off about something. CNN and all the rest had coverage of Byrd passing. The same could have been said of MSNBC for what? How long they've been existance? oklanole, they're apart of NBC. Give Fox a pass on what?
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Annie Ultimate Joined: 02 May 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 17544	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:01am
	*Originally posted by dockbumper5* *Originally posted by boomerjake* It’s sad that you have to think the worst of someone’s motives. But when you look at the facts, not waiving the Jones act, slowing state and local government from acting, refusing the help from other country’s assets, what else could someone deduce? You remind me of the people who said George Bush lied just to invade Iraq..........., are you really serious?? What else could someone deduce??? How about this, Obama and his team have no idea on how to handle a crisis? They are/were afraid to take control of the spill. They are incompetent. Obama is not qualified. etc.........., don't expect people with common sense to believe Obama is actually happy this happened, and he wants it to keep getting worse....... I don't think he wanted this to happen or wants it to get worse............. just as I don't think that he wants American citizens being killed and living in fear along the Tucson zone of the Arizona-Mexican border. I do, however, think that he is unwilling to do that which is necessary to assist these people. I don't know if he is afraid of the unions, feels that nothing will work and it is in the best interest of the federal government to wait until they are in a position of power where they can get the bills passed (cap and 'tax', amnesty in an omnibus immigration bill, etc.). What comes across is that this President will continue the practice of his years in the Illinois legislature and the U.S. Senate: sit on the fence and watch others batter their brains out and then try to come in and fashion a win out of the remaining pieces.
	“If you don’t know where you are going, any road will get you there.” ― Lewis Carroll
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dockbumper5 Big Daddy Joined: 06 January 2010 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 2510	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:02am
	*Originally posted by boomerjake* *Originally posted by dockbumper5* *Originally posted by boomerjake* It’s sad that you have to think the worst of someone’s motives. But when you look at the facts, not waiving the Jones act, slowing state and local government from acting, refusing the help from other country’s assets, what else could someone deduce? You remind me of the people who said George Bush lied just to invade Iraq..........., are you really serious?? What else could someone deduce??? How about this, Obama and his team have no idea on how to handle a crisis? They are/were afraid to take control of the spill. They are incompetent. Obama is not qualified. etc.........., don't expect people with common sense to believe Obama is actually happy this happened, and he wants it to keep getting worse....... And you remind me of the jackass who thought their rent, gas, and groceries were all going to be paid with the election of Obama. Look you nitwit, it wasn’t me who said, "Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." You’re such a buffoon you have no idea who is the originator of that quote. With statements like that, and confirmation by their actions, it’s completely plausible this administration would use it to the political advantage. Your name calling tells it all....touched a nerve and you don't know how to handle it......You remind me of a few things too jake, but I won't stoop to your level. Have fun in the gutter..... Edited by dockbumper5 - 28 June 2010 at 11:03am
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boomerjake Big League Joined: 22 April 2009 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 4303	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:13am
	*Originally posted by dockbumper5* *Originally posted by boomerjake* *Originally posted by dockbumper5* *Originally posted by boomerjake* It’s sad that you have to think the worst of someone’s motives. But when you look at the facts, not waiving the Jones act, slowing state and local government from acting, refusing the help from other country’s assets, what else could someone deduce? You remind me of the people who said George Bush lied just to invade Iraq..........., are you really serious?? What else could someone deduce??? How about this, Obama and his team have no idea on how to handle a crisis? They are/were afraid to take control of the spill. They are incompetent. Obama is not qualified. etc.........., don't expect people with common sense to believe Obama is actually happy this happened, and he wants it to keep getting worse....... And you remind me of the jackass who thought their rent, gas, and groceries were all going to be paid with the election of Obama. Look you nitwit, it wasn’t me who said, "Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." You’re such a buffoon you have no idea who is the originator of that quote. With statements like that, and confirmation by their actions, it’s completely plausible this administration would use it to the political advantage. Your name calling tells it all....touched a nerve and you don't know how to handle it......You remind me of a few things too jake, but I won't stoop to your level. Have fun in the gutter..... One of your recent posts spoke of how you know you’re hated. I got a chuckle out of that. Why? Because you’re irrelevant. You’re not thought enough by anyone to care one way or the other. I’ve gotten to where I only take a casual interest in something you posts, and then when I do I end up wishing I had those few seconds back in my life. And the name calling, well you’ve earned, so wear it well.
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Annie Ultimate Joined: 02 May 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 17544	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:17am
	Oklanole, Jake, whoever......................Each of you may have your own definition of 'mainstream media'. Some people put anything in the category that is liberal. Others throw in Fox (the only media that puts forward views other than liberals.............and they even include some liberals). In the dictionary, mainstream is defined as "The prevailing current of thought, influence, or activity". A couple decades ago the tag was applied to the print and TV media that dominated throughout the country. The large media types seen or read across the country included the likes of ABC, CBS, NBC, NY Times, Chicago Tribune, Washington Post, LA Times and the like. Cable news was not included at that time. It did not have the reach. As to now, only Fox News is seen by a significant number of people and it is dwarfed by the combo of ABC, CBS, & NBS (who often sign out of the same hymnal). Oklanole, this is NOT a word made up by people on this forum. Personally, when I use the term, I am not referencing any cable news.
	“If you don’t know where you are going, any road will get you there.” ― Lewis Carroll
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dockbumper5 Big Daddy Joined: 06 January 2010 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 2510	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 11:27am
	*Originally posted by boomerjake* *Originally posted by dockbumper5* *Originally posted by boomerjake* *Originally posted by dockbumper5* *Originally posted by boomerjake* It’s sad that you have to think the worst of someone’s motives. But when you look at the facts, not waiving the Jones act, slowing state and local government from acting, refusing the help from other country’s assets, what else could someone deduce? You remind me of the people who said George Bush lied just to invade Iraq..........., are you really serious?? What else could someone deduce??? How about this, Obama and his team have no idea on how to handle a crisis? They are/were afraid to take control of the spill. They are incompetent. Obama is not qualified. etc.........., don't expect people with common sense to believe Obama is actually happy this happened, and he wants it to keep getting worse....... And you remind me of the jackass who thought their rent, gas, and groceries were all going to be paid with the election of Obama. Look you nitwit, it wasn’t me who said, "Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." You’re such a buffoon you have no idea who is the originator of that quote. With statements like that, and confirmation by their actions, it’s completely plausible this administration would use it to the political advantage. Your name calling tells it all....touched a nerve and you don't know how to handle it......You remind me of a few things too jake, but I won't stoop to your level. Have fun in the gutter..... One of your recent posts spoke of how you know you’re hated. I got a chuckle out of that. Why? Because you’re irrelevant. You’re not thought enough by anyone to care one way or the other. I’ve gotten to where I only take a casual interest in something you posts, and then when I do I end up wishing I had those few seconds back in my life. And the name calling, well you’ve earned, so wear it well. Whatever........if you are proud of your name calling, that tells me all I need to know about you. Have fun living in the gutter.....
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oklanole Solid Individual Joined: 19 April 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 882	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 3:30pm
	Jake/Annie, I was only considering cable. Both FNC and MSNBC came to cable around the same time. Jake, when I say pass it is to the numerous here that seems to think that Fox doesn't have a slant. I saw it once again this morning with Byrd v Biden as mentioned above.
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Annie Ultimate Joined: 02 May 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 17544	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 4:05pm
	*Originally posted by oklanole* Jake/Annie, I was only considering cable. Both FNC and MSNBC came to cable around the same time. Jake, when I say pass it is to the numerous here that seems to think that Fox doesn't have a slant. I saw it once again this morning with Byrd v Biden as mentioned above. Oklanole, this is not my definition. For years the definition revolved around the large media that was read, seen, heard across the country. Only in the last few years has Fox news come to the point that it has pushed a million viewers. Cable news did not reach the masses when the term began to be used. Matter of fact, when the term was first coined, Fox news did not exist. I have not thought or had the impression that Fox did not have a slant in its op ed programming. I do not look at Hannity as hard news......................The same goes for Olbermann. On the straight news side (i.e., Baier, Wallace, the morning and afternoon news, etc.), there is much effort to provide more than one side of an issue. What I hear is that if one wants to have a clue about a conservative, Republican or Libertarian slant, you will find it difficult on ABC news, NBC news, CBS news, the NY Times, the Washington Post, etc. Conversely, you can find people expressing liberal/Democratic views on Fox.
	“If you don’t know where you are going, any road will get you there.” ― Lewis Carroll
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roy4pokes Ultimate Joined: 10 August 2005 Online Status: Offline Posts: 14193	Posted: 28 June 2010 at 4:32pm
	*Originally posted by oklanole* Jake/Annie, I was only considering cable. Both FNC and MSNBC came to cable around the same time. Jake, when I say pass it is to the numerous here that seems to think that Fox doesn't have a slant. I saw it once again this morning with Byrd v Biden as mentioned above. sure Fox, CNN and MSNBC have slants. Especially Fox and MSNBC. But if you do an internet search regarding the definition of "mainstream media", Fox and MSNBC and CNN are not included in most, if not all, definitions. At least not now.
	"Life's tough. It's even tougher if you're stupid." - John Wayne Go green - recycle Congress in 2010
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